Comments on: Anna

By: Anne

Anne — Sat, 24 Feb 2007 04:35:38 +0000

“You are not called yet” does not mean your parents are condemning you. If one believes (as I do) that all people will be called to God’s purpose in HIS time, then some are called earlier than others. It is in NO way meaning that you are condemned.
Please don’t feel bitter about your parents saying that, or even thinking it.
I have 4 sons … all of whom have said they would come back to “the church” some day. (what church?) I just hope that someday they believe in God … the God of the Bible.
If they are not “called” at this time I am the one who has to deal with that emotionally … of course I want my sons and my grandchildren to believe what I believe … I wouldn’t be human if I didn’t. Don’t Catholics want their children to be Catholics? Don’t Jews want their children to be Jews? Don’t Muslims want their children to be Muslims?
Don’t kid yourself … you’ve left the religion of your parents and that is your choice. But that doesn’t mean they don’t feel the loss. We all have to make our own decisions. I have let my sons make theirs. I wish your parents would let you make your decisions in peace without guilt. But if they can’t try not to be too harsh.

By: Robert

Robert — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 07:56:57 +0000

Tabitha,

I’m quite familiar with The Painful Truth— it’s a good site, and I’m glad you find this site useful.

The only nit I will pick with your comment is where you say “that churches have made people lose their faith.” It was not the WCG or any particular church that made me lose my faith. If you want to blame anything, then blame the Internet. In 1995 when I gained access to the Internet I also gained access to a world of ideas I never had before, including the arguments of atheists in their own words, instead of the gross mischaracterizations handed out by ministers, priests, and the brainwashed and fearful laity. Fortunately, I also had enough prior training in critical thought to evaluate those arguments fairly, and the rest is history.

By: Tabitha

Tabitha — Sat, 30 Dec 2006 17:45:52 +0000

I completely understand. I’m not trying to characterize athiests. I find myself being bitter ALOT! I just catch and try turning it around. I’m so not trying to label anyone anything. I respect your beliefs and everyone elses. But from my point of view it’s very angering to me that church’s have made people lose their faith when they are supposed to be restoring it. That’s all.
I just found this site. I don’t know if HTML works but in case it doesn’t I’ll copy and paste the address at the end. Pretty interesting stuff. They call the site “The Painful Truth”.

CLICK HERE
or
http://www.hwarmstrong.com/

And I never thanked you for this site. We all have alot of experiences in common. It really helps feeling like less of an outsider to know alot of other kids had the same problems. (although it sucks it happened to begin with)
So, thank you :0)

By: Robert

Robert — Fri, 29 Dec 2006 21:33:14 +0000

Tabitha,

I accept that you too are disaffected by organized religion. I also accept that you have the freedom to believe whatever you want.

That said, I’m also not surprised you characterize me (and presumably other non-theists) as “bitter” towards God. The fact is, I (and many others) have come to the reasoned conclusion that if there is a God, 1) There is no credible evidence for it and 2) It must be nothing at all like the anthropomorphic deity that major religions depict. In light of the lack of evidence, it makes more sense to hold an open-minded non-belief (skepticism) towards God-claims such as yours.

I’m glad you are happy with your beliefs, and I am happy as a humanist/atheist. And while I can be angry at past injustices perpetrated by people, I can hardly blame them on some god in which I don’t even believe.

By: Tabitha

Tabitha — Fri, 29 Dec 2006 16:17:03 +0000

I wasn’t trying to be preachy at all. And I deeply apologize if I came across that way. I respect your beliefs and I was by no means trying to convert you to mine. I was just in hopes that you would consider looking at things in a bit more positive light. You’re letting them win by being so bitter. And I’m sure Armstrong is smirking in his grave at that.
I don’t know why God lets things happen. Maybe it’s cause he’s not going to babysit us or maybe we needed to be tougher than everybody else for some reason down the road. I have no clue. I just know he’s done great things for me when all I had to do was ask sincerely. And I may know nothing and it just may be the way the universe rolls. The possibilities are endless. But I do feel He is here and he isn’t what WCG portrayed.
I am in complete agreeance with all religions being corrupt. I won’t step foot in a church unless it’s a wedding or a funeral. You don’t need church to be enlightened or inspired. That’s just for profit as all you know.
Again, I’m really not trying to come down on anyone or preach. I’m not 100% sure that what I believe is right. No one can be. I’m just trying to display a different prespective for you to look at. And if you don’t look at it then that’s totally cool too.
K, hope you guys have an awesome day. :0)

By: mark mullins

mark mullins — Fri, 29 Dec 2006 04:45:06 +0000

where do i begin. I was four years old when i kept my first day of atonement - this was in 1966.

Wait .. what’s the point here - i grew up in a cult - i left - “The church” as it was when i was in it is no more - the people responsible for that mess- hwa, gta, waterhouse and all the others, Elder tkach was in on it too-are all dead now - i am alive and loving life as never before - without “the church” and all its guilt .

i could blame all my drug abuse and wasted years on the church - but here’s the thing- it was my choice to do those things - granted i had to go with my parents - but the other stuff i did was up to me- i got away from it got cleaned up married a wonderful woman and have a sweetheart of a daughter - so do i regret not being able to play sports - got to dances - eat pepparoni pizza and shrimp yes but i do those things now -now - lying to people at school about christmas, easter and halloween - sitting in the library while those parties are going on- yes i regret those things and alot of others too.
i have found that making sure my daughter is aware of all the wolves in sheep clothing out there under the guise of religon is the best thing i can do now break the cycle.

god is still in our house and always will be - but no man is telling me who he is, or what i have to do see him.

to see that, all i have to do is watch my daughter as she grows - the ocean- miles from nowhere in the forest - the stars at night - listen to my own heartbeat after all the crap i put it through.

i leave you with this - and it sounds trite i know - we all have choices - what we do with them is up to us -

Thanks for letting me ay my piece - after all this time it sure is a lot different than when i left that bunch!!!!

By: Robert

Robert — Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:46:43 +0000

Tabitha,

Your comment is borderline-preachy, so I considered not approving it. But I decided that you might be worth reasoning with.

My logic is very simple, and I’d like to know what you think: You say that, “it wasn’t God that gave you beatings, etc. etc.” and then blame it on Anna’s parents and “those psycho followers and leaders.” You want to absolve God of all responsibility for grief caused in his name. But this is absurd, because if God wanted to, surely he could have prevented these abuses, especially when carried out in his name. So the only possible conclusions are: 1) God has chosen to let these abuses take place with his full knowledge, or 2) God does not exist. If you ascribe to 1) then why do you let God off for behavior that we would never condone in another human?

And you can tell your mother that it’s not just the WCG that was crazy… it’s all religion.

By: Tabitha

Tabitha — Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:51:17 +0000

I was born in the WWCG. Luckier than my two older sisters, I didn’t grow up in the worst part of it and what was forced down my throat I was determined to ignore and spit out. And I believe that determination is why I’m not as damaged as most my peers and sisters.
My mother is also in United now. It just totally hit home when you mentioned your mother saying “God hasn’t chosen you”. Like your parents, my mother doesn’t believe any of it is wrong and she looks at me when I say something she doesn’t want to admit makes sense and says ” God just hasn’t called you yet and I hope he will before the Tribulation”.
It’s sickening that she believes her children are doomed because we didn’t fall victim to all the insanity Mr. Armstrong plauged on the world.
I just hope you don’t shut God out. It’s not his fault. He wasn’t in that church.
The believers in that WWCG never accomplished anything because they waited for the world the end and waited for God to just give them what they wanted or needed. You’re doing right to take initative and do things yourself but you still need His guidance. Not do for you but to do with you.
I’m not soap boxing it by any means. I have my bad days too. I just see too many blogs on here that that stupid church has made a bad name for God. And that makes me sad cause it wasn’t God that gave you beatings, mentally abused you and deprived you of your childhood and Saturday morning cartoons Friday night / Saturday games. It was your parents and it was those psycho followers and leaders. But it wasn’t God.
I hope you will not turn your back on Him.
I wish you the best. I wish you all the best.

p.s. I was trying to convince my mother that the church was crazy and I told her about this website and all the damaged it’s caused the children that grew up in it and you know what she said? “That’s the Devil working through the internet.” Go figure…

By: Liz

Liz — Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:41:39 +0000

I, too, was born into WCG in 1978, left at 18, more because I fell away than anything else, in a period during which the church was in flux and from a ‘church’ to which I was chained but never appreciated within. I, too, remember the ’spankings’, from either a belt, or a wooden spoon, or a metal spoon or when they were angry enough just a good old fashioned wallop around the head. I remember being dragged by the ear out of service because I hadn’t heard my father when he whispered to me mid-sermon to pick up my bible study. Literally by the ear. I remember being raised as an outsider within an outsider’s church because I just wasn’t good enough. I remember lying at school (damn me to hell…) that I was in the corner at the disco, I was there, you just didn’t see me. I remember my friend’s mother practically crying because I refused to eat pork and beef sausages, even though my father wouldn’t know, because God would and my father would smell it on me. Being terrified I was going to get clouted because I was delayed on a charity outing because it had gone after sunset. Having my father smell my fingers because I once picked up a cigarette in the street to see what it looked like, in order to make sure I hadn’t been smoking (age 7). Not knowing what date my birthday was until 1989 when I was 11. Taking a paper round at 11 in order to start saving for tuition at AC. Attending a college where one of the tutors was ex-communicated and having to never mention anything that could possibly link me to the church because they had been known to make student’s lives unbearable. To have it listed in a National Newspaper that your ‘Church’ was a ‘Cult’ and that they were affiliated to Waco. To have people physically abuse you because they thought ‘you lot’ needed loosening up. To have people tell me that there are ’schools for people like me…’ To never have enough to eat because your parents had to tithe the majority of their money. To have the church, after your father had been discommunicated for disagreeing with the elder, continue to send you newsletters so that you wouldn’t feel ‘abandoned’ when in reality they were trying to poach you back… To have the satisfaction of being able to tell the Regional Director’s Wife politely but succinctly why you no longer wished to receive her poxy newsletter: priceless

By: Stephen Wallace

Stephen Wallace — Mon, 06 Nov 2006 01:45:05 +0000

Hi Anna,
Thanks for sharing… I guess the only good things to come out of it all is that we are not alone in our experiences, and that we are the wiser for it. We can help others by sharing our life stories. Focusing on the positive aspects is the key… something I am slowly learning myself.
As for people who are still trapped in the cult world, they have to reach their own realisation and understanding, if they can. My mother still attends WCG, whether it is the new “born again” version or some offshoot of Armstrongism, I do not know. Each to their own.
Music was (and still is) the thing that saved me from insanity. So I guess everyone needs to find what works for them, and if it is God in some form, I have nothing against it personally. The problems occur when it is forced upon people, as it was on us. If a person wants to worship the tree in their backyard, that is fine by me, just don’t go trying to convert others to your beliefs. Sorry to rave on
I too was very angry, but with the help of a therapist, I am learning to let go of it all and move on with my life. It is a journey, and if you need help to make it, go out and get it.

To April,
Enjoyed your post too. I can relate very well. Thanks for sharing also.

Regards,
Stephen